Comments on: Avoiding redundant title attributes http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/ A collection of tips, guidance and practical suggestions in developing accessible websites Thu, 08 Sep 2011 19:48:58 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: SFCite | Blog | 25 Ways to Make Your WordPress Website More Accessible http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/comment-page-1/#comment-312 SFCite | Blog | 25 Ways to Make Your WordPress Website More Accessible Thu, 27 Jan 2011 18:36:58 +0000 http://www.wp-dev.isolutia.com/?p=20#comment-312 [...] Title attributes are often misused. Here’s a good example: [...] [...] Title attributes are often misused. Here’s a good example: [...]

]]> By: Anup http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/comment-page-1/#comment-151 Anup Sat, 25 Apr 2009 14:08:38 +0000 http://www.wp-dev.isolutia.com/?p=20#comment-151 Good post. Regarding SEO benefits from using title attributes: my understanding and experience is that it has either no bearing on SEO or very little. Although these two are slightly old posts now, they provide further info: 1) A small note about title tooltips happens to be mentioned here: http://www.onenaught.com/posts/33/seo-for-sake-of-seo-misses-the-point 2) Includes a list of top factors that prominent SEO experts agree were important in 2007 and compares that to 2005 (as years go on, technical things become less and less of a factor) http://www.onenaught.com/posts/30/explaining-natural-seo-search-engine-ranking-vs-indexing Good post.

Regarding SEO benefits from using title attributes: my understanding and experience is that it has either no bearing on SEO or very little.

Although these two are slightly old posts now, they provide further info:

1) A small note about title tooltips happens to be mentioned here:
http://www.onenaught.com/posts/33/seo-for-sake-of-seo-misses-the-point

2) Includes a list of top factors that prominent SEO experts agree were important in 2007 and compares that to 2005 (as years go on, technical things become less and less of a factor)
http://www.onenaught.com/posts/30/explaining-natural-seo-search-engine-ranking-vs-indexing

]]> By: Isofarro http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/comment-page-1/#comment-106 Isofarro Mon, 02 Feb 2009 20:34:58 +0000 http://www.wp-dev.isolutia.com/?p=20#comment-106 Peter, no. Web accessibility is making content perceivable, operable, understandable and robust for people with disabilities. There are benefits for non-disabled people, but this is a side-effect of web accessibility, not the primary purpose. It is fairly important that the distinction is understood. Peter, no. Web accessibility is making content perceivable, operable, understandable and robust for people with disabilities. There are benefits for non-disabled people, but this is a side-effect of web accessibility, not the primary purpose. It is fairly important that the distinction is understood.

]]> By: Isofarro http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/comment-page-1/#comment-105 Isofarro Mon, 02 Feb 2009 20:34:18 +0000 http://www.wp-dev.isolutia.com/?p=20#comment-105 Scott, yes, if the appropriate text-equivalent you put into an alt attribute is content that already exists on the page in a text format, then the alt attribute is essentially redundant and it can be a null alt instead (alt=""). The one exception to this is when the image is the only thing inside an anchor link - since then a situation will be created where there's no link text, and the screen reader will attempt to divine something readable from the image source URL. Scott, yes, if the appropriate text-equivalent you put into an alt attribute is content that already exists on the page in a text format, then the alt attribute is essentially redundant and it can be a null alt instead (alt=”"). The one exception to this is when the image is the only thing inside an anchor link – since then a situation will be created where there’s no link text, and the screen reader will attempt to divine something readable from the image source URL.

]]> By: Peter Stevens http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/comment-page-1/#comment-104 Peter Stevens Sun, 22 Jun 2008 16:55:21 +0000 http://www.wp-dev.isolutia.com/?p=20#comment-104 This is an interesting debate, and I hope you'll permit me to make the following comment. The view being propounded here is that accessibility design is somehow _only_ for disabled people - can we perish this? My view, even if it seems outrageous, is that designing for accessibility enriches the web experience for _all_ visitors, regardless of disAbility! So, I'm not sure that I agree with the redundancy of the title attribute for hyperlinks - quite the reverse! Quite apart from the SEO aspects, which are fairly important, giving any visitor a helpful text tooltip of where the link is likely to take them is the main bonus. In Opera for example, links without the title attribute still display a tooltip, but with only an often unintelligible URL. Much better to prefix that with a human readable indicator - surely? As far as screen readers are concerned, my belief is that users are able to configure how the software deals with the absence, or not, of link title attributes So far, I'm not sufficiently convinced that ommiting titles from links is a good thing - so I'll be leaving them in place. This is an interesting debate, and I hope you’ll permit me to make the following comment. The view being propounded here is that accessibility design is somehow _only_ for disabled people – can we perish this? My view, even if it seems outrageous, is that designing for accessibility enriches the web experience for _all_ visitors, regardless of disAbility!

So, I’m not sure that I agree with the redundancy of the title attribute for hyperlinks – quite the reverse! Quite apart from the SEO aspects, which are fairly important, giving any visitor a helpful text tooltip of where the link is likely to take them is the main bonus. In Opera for example, links without the title attribute still display a tooltip, but with only an often unintelligible URL. Much better to prefix that with a human readable indicator – surely?

As far as screen readers are concerned, my belief is that users are able to configure how the software deals with the absence, or not, of link title attributes

So far, I’m not sufficiently convinced that ommiting titles from links is a good thing – so I’ll be leaving them in place.

]]> By: Scott Lenger http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/comment-page-1/#comment-103 Scott Lenger Thu, 19 Jun 2008 21:26:59 +0000 http://www.wp-dev.isolutia.com/?p=20#comment-103 Confirmed what I had assumed. Would the same logic: "title attribute being used to provide the same information that's already available and accessible." work for the img alt attribute, assuming a description already exists within the page content? Confirmed what I had assumed. Would the same logic:

“title attribute being used to provide the same information that’s already available and accessible.”

work for the img alt attribute, assuming a description already exists within the page content?

]]> By: Isofarro http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/comment-page-1/#comment-102 Isofarro Mon, 12 May 2008 14:45:04 +0000 http://www.wp-dev.isolutia.com/?p=20#comment-102 Andre asks: "What about microformats? Can´t we use microformats to improve accessibility?" As they currently stand, microformats do nothing to improve the accessibility of a page. In two particular cases, the abbr datetime pattern and its geo-location relative, the content added in the name of microformats actually creates an accessibility barrier to screen reader users who chose to take advantage of marked up abbreviations. Andre asks: “What about microformats? Can´t we use microformats to improve accessibility?”

As they currently stand, microformats do nothing to improve the accessibility of a page. In two particular cases, the abbr datetime pattern and its geo-location relative, the content added in the name of microformats actually creates an accessibility barrier to screen reader users who chose to take advantage of marked up abbreviations.

]]> By: Andre http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/comment-page-1/#comment-101 Andre Wed, 07 May 2008 16:21:27 +0000 http://www.wp-dev.isolutia.com/?p=20#comment-101 Hi, well, from an SEO perspective the title-attribute is very useful. It provides machine-readable content that fits into the context (both: context of the page and context of the linked site). It´s one of the most overlooked possibilities in onPge-SEO. So when I have to decide between SEO an accessibility, I choose SEO, of course. What about microformats? Can´t we use microformats to improve accessibility? Hi, well, from an SEO perspective the title-attribute is very useful. It provides machine-readable content that fits into the context (both: context of the page and context of the linked site). It´s one of the most overlooked possibilities in onPge-SEO.

So when I have to decide between SEO an accessibility, I choose SEO, of course. What about microformats? Can´t we use microformats to improve accessibility?

]]> By: Mark McKay http://accessibilitytips.com/2008/04/14/avoiding-redundant-title-attributes/comment-page-1/#comment-100 Mark McKay Fri, 18 Apr 2008 14:26:04 +0000 http://www.wp-dev.isolutia.com/?p=20#comment-100 Great post! Another point about titles is that by default screen readers like Jaws don't read them. You have to enable this feature. Which most people never do. So if a designer uses inappropriate link text and tries to fix this by using a title most users will never see/hear it. Also different browsers display differing amounts of the title text. So you can't even be sure that all of the text you put in a title will be seen by a user. Titles have their place but I think at the present time a lot of people are over/miss using them. Mark Great post!

Another point about titles is that by default screen readers like Jaws don’t read them. You have to enable this feature. Which most people never do. So if a designer uses inappropriate link text and tries to fix this by using a title most users will never see/hear it.

Also different browsers display differing amounts of the title text. So you can’t even be sure that all of the text you put in a title will be seen by a user.

Titles have their place but I think at the present time a lot of people are over/miss using them.

Mark

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